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Age of Empires / Rise of Rome / Definitive Edition
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Age of Empires Heaven » Forums » Age of Empires / Rise of Rome / Definitive Edition » RoR Remake (Using AoM Game Engine)
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Topic Subject:RoR Remake (Using AoM Game Engine)
layz
Banned
posted 05-03-12 05:07 AM ET (US)         
There's a lot of details on the remake on the website.

http://thronesoftime.com

It's a complete remake of rise of rome, using aom's game engine, almost combining the two games into one. Plays a lot like rise of rome, is not slow like AoM.

The hill country map is pretty much exactly what we are used to playing in ror.

The youtube channel for preview vids is here :
http://www.youtube.com/user/ThronesofTime?feature=mhee

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-03-2012 @ 05:08 AM).]

AuthorReplies:
PhatFish
Mr. Beta
posted 05-04-12 08:46 AM ET (US)     1 / 17       
TBH it is looking not too different from AoM. Would call it more of a mod than a remake.



layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 04:50 AM ET (US)     2 / 17       
Yea, It's a heavily modded AoM into a completely different game. That's pretty much how a new game can be made am I right or am I right? I am right. The way I see it is I didn't do what they did, I did what they DIDN'T DO.

Let's see... how many other games fps for example use the same game engine but are completely different games? How about other types of games. Pretty sure more than one FPS uses the CRY engine.

There is nothing AoM about the way this plays. To say so is ridiculous.

Look in the other thread on my new post and read it.

What you see on the surface is not even close to what you think it is 90% of the time.

Remove yourself from looking at everything from an AoM frame of mind. Everything has been completely destroyed and remade for the most part.

See I know once a few AoE players play the game and tell thier friends about it, other people will follow, so I'm not really worried about what you guys are saying that it looks eactly like AoM at this point. You are just doing the equivalent of reading a book before you have even opened it.

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 05:46 AM).]

PhatFish
Mr. Beta
posted 05-05-12 10:38 AM ET (US)     3 / 17       
I haven't seen any screenshots. Only videos, and in my opinion it doesnt differ too much from AoM (yet), which is why I said it looks more like a mod than a remake.

Also, I've seen someone selling this mod/addon/remake whatever you want to call it (the cd from the main site). Why? Access to the beta should be free right.



layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 12:20 PM ET (US)     4 / 17       
The main site sells accounts and once you purchase that the cd is shipped to you for free with the account information.

The whole protox and tech tree has been rewritten along with 50+ maps, and many other files being adjusted.

Nothing in the game is even really close to the same as aom.

You can have your own opinion, but you just see things from an aom perspective, and that is the wrong way to look at it.


here's an explanation on flipped perspectives.



What do you see in that image? Just a huskarl with a different name right? Especially if it were in as pixelated as the videos are.

What I see is a unit that throws axes and also attacks with melee and each of those attacks have different bonus modifiers and damage. While I got you looking at that take a close look at all his stats notice anything unusual? He runs faster than AoM's cavalry (The maps are four times BIGGER). Now go ahead and check the rest of his stats.. Anything else? Yea, there's a lot more than what meets the surface if you are trying to look at this and think what is in AoM is the same as what is in here.

While I got you looking at stats here's an Age 4 Babylon Town center.


The amount of wood/food/gold/hp/armor/texture each mine/huntable/herbable/tree has.

Every SINGLE UNITS armor/run speed/pop limit/damage types/name/tooltip text/los/attack range/functions/limit on how many you can make/what they counter/texture/anim/everything else that a unit has/can do/lookslike/etc.

Every single thing in the game pretty much ebing retextured to look better.

Every single buildings texture touched up or changed, along with armor/damage/name/tooltip/los/attack range/functions text.

Every single "god" changed into a civilization and changed everything into what units can be made from which civilization. Also changed the way each one functions to be very unique from eachother.

50+ Maps recoded to be how I wanted them to be and different from one another.

These screenshots are still not game quality.
Persia Military :




This is just how they look during beta there will be a lot of more texturing being done during beta as it was a part that I somewhat rushed through. That armories HP is before the upgrade "Reinforcements". Which is one of the key upgrades in the game. It's the upgrade in the bottom right of the armory.

Armory HP after reinforcements and an example of the assyrian upgrades from it. Accurate doesn't mean what you think, they break bows/skulls, that is thier special attack.


This is one way eggy collects resources, no more mining pits and lumber camps for them :



Example of the granary before Economically favored/stone tablets, are activated by other techs and put in there :

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 01:46 PM).]

Basse
Clubman
posted 05-05-12 02:15 PM ET (US)     5 / 17       
the cd is shipped to you for free
What will the CD contain? Wouldn't it be easier to provide the buyer a code for a digital download instead?
PhatFish
Mr. Beta
posted 05-05-12 02:39 PM ET (US)     6 / 17       
I agree with basse. Screenshots aren't working btw.

Say whatever you like about your creation, I still think it is a mod closely resembling the original AoM and it's expansion, regardless of how I am supposed to look at it.
You have NO IDEA how long and how much thinking/planning/designing this took
Being around for ages here on HG and having played several modifications/addons for all the Age of games, I have a pretty good idea of the amount of work that has gone in to this, as most of us oldies do. Don't get me wrong, I think it's wonderful what you're trying to achieve here and we defenately support such things.

However, I think charging people to play this will only scare them off, especially since the fees are quite high and when they do have an account (non-premium member), they are not fully supported with updates. If you look at some of the most succesfull mods released (Age of Chivalry, Rome at War for example), they are all free to play despite the loads of effort that went into these.

Also remember that both AoE and AoM are quite old now, both over 10 years old, so only the most hardcore fans are most likely to give it a try.



layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 02:48 PM ET (US)     7 / 17       
The screenshots are working fine for me, try quoting my message and using the direct urls and see if that works for you.


However it plays nothing like AoM. Let me know if you get those ss working, you get to see some decent details and the scythe/chariots. No charioteer in those images though just the other two versions. Including elite versions there is 6 types of chariots.

It's been recoded to play so different, almost to the point where I couldn't even explain all the differences at this point in time.

Besides recoding doesnt = looking. Most of the changes are what the eye cannot see on teh surface especially if you cant read upgrade texts or the techtree/protox itself.

Something tells me you also skipped details maybe as to which units they have. I AM NOT A MODELER however after I get support and a small player base I will be finding me one.

Any person that likes Age of games I think should give it a try as it is very different than any of them made including AoM. It most resembles RoR Gameplay wise, and AoM looks wise.

The cd will have an installer.

I've dealt with electronic funds and digital downloads before when I was selling an ebook I wrote. I ended up switching to selling it on cd's for more than one reason.


As far as normal members goes, they will get some updates mainly, texture, models, some balancing (everything that needs balancing will get it). Pretty much all the updates that go into premium but update the members side of the game will also be updated... (Just the premium balance updates won't be, they are two different things as they have more eras).


Premium members will get a lot more though, including tournaments for cash prizes once there is a good amount of players. Depending on how the tournaments are carried out and the amount of players playing it could be over $100 for first place alone with second and third having some too. I've got a few good ideas for how to carry out some tournaments to give high valued prizes. Different types of tournaments that is. Can't do these without a good sized playerbase.

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 03:50 PM).]

plismo
Clubman
posted 05-05-12 04:09 PM ET (US)     8 / 17       
In my personal opinion people would not play the ROR remake for one reason. People like the original ROR it is a true good design; the problem is that changing is like making a totally different game. If you could imitate what the original game does most civilizations are balance in RM and maybe imbalance at DM but people like how the original game is made. What they might look is to have the same gameplay with better graphics; adding totally new effects is like playing a totally different game. If you are true gamer that played RM online and DM you would understand better than any other player. It wouldn't make any more sense a KOR hills with Assyrian anymore or a conti with hittite.
layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 04:22 PM ET (US)     9 / 17       
What they might look is to have the same gameplay with better graphics; adding totally new effects is like playing a totally different game.
That's pretty much exactly what this is.

While it has a lot of similarities to RoR, there is quite a few things that make it different.


If you read the civilization notes you will see that there is a ton of things that are similar in there, uncluding the unit choices.

And yes, it is pretty much like playing a totally different game than both RoR and AoM. It plays more like RoR than AoM though.

I want it to be different for a reason. I also want it to play a lot like RoR for a reason.

Whenever you see a chariot below it can convert into one of two things. A charioteer or a scythe chariot.
War elephants can convert into Armored Elephants.

I played both RM and DM. Mostly DM at first then got into RM right before zone went out. I kinda put assyria/sumer ror bonuses into one (assy) but still different. Assy are stilla quick start civ for RM.


Read this :
Greek:
Cavalry 20% damage vs buildings, run 25% faster, do 33% more damage, and have 50% more hp.
Villagers gather faith faster.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Bowmen - Hippikon - Hoplite
Age 3 Units :
Horse Archer - Sarissophoroi - Broad Swordsman
Age 4 Units :
Elite Prodromos - Centurion
Myth Units :
Satyr - Hydra - Medusa
Heros :
Persephone - Creator (Hero)
Siege Units :
Siege Tower - Helopolis

Cultural Technology - Natural Aggression
Civilization Technology - Lord of Horses

Greek functions somewhat normally, villagers gain faith by praying at temples, they grow fruit trees for food, and have access to mirror towers.

--------------


Roman



Creationist attack 250% faster and can convery human soldiers and buildings.
Infantry deal 15% more damage vs buildings and attack 33% faster.
Villagers build faster.
Buildings are cheaper.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Peltast - Swordsman - Hoplite
Age 3 Units :
Composite Bowman - Phalanx - Camelry
Age 4 Units :
Elite Chariot - Legionnaire
Myth Units :
Satyr - Petsuchos - Colossus
Heros :
Creationist - Creator (Hero)
Siege Units :
Ballista - Fire Siphon

Cultural Technology - Natural Aggression
Civilization Technology - Roman Courage


---------


Hittites



Buildings have more hitpoints.
Catapults/Petrobolos have double hp, and bonus attack vs human soldiers.
Archers attack 33% faster.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Bowmen - Slinger - Short Swordsman
Age 3 Units :
War Elephant - Short Bowmen - Javelin Thrower
Age 4 Units :
Hittite Long Swordsman - Elite Chariot
Myth Units :
Psychic - Necromancer - Astrologist
Heros :
Priestess - Psychic (Hero) - Cultist - Astrologist (Hero)
Siege Units :
Stone Thrower - Catapult

Cultural Technology - Natural Aggression
Civilization Technology - Bone Bow Handles
---------


Egyptian



Pharoah
Priests Empower
Chariots have 50% more hp.
Camelry has more hp.
Siege units move faster.
Chariot Archers move faster.
Farms cost less and can be built at an earlier age.
Priests can convert human soldiers.


Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Spearman - Slinger - Axeman
Age 3 Units :
War Elephant - Chariot - Camelry
Age 4 Units :
Khopeshman - Elite Chariot Archer
Myth Units :
Anubite - Sphinx - Roc - Mummy
Heros :
Priest - Pharaoh
Siege Units :
Siege Tower - Catapult

Cultural Technology - Book of Secrets
Civilization Technology - Yoke Saddle

Egyptian gain faith by building monuments.
Egyptian use monuments, ziggurats, and town centers for storage pits.
---------


Assyrian



Sun Temples
Pharaoh like leader
Archers Train Faster
Migdols cost less.
Creationists can convert human soldiers.
Siege weapons attack 33% faster.
Archers have more range and damage.
Creationists build outposts faster.
Villagers mine gold faster.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Falcatasman - Slinger - Bowman
Age 3 Units :
Composite Bowman - Chariot - Numidian Cavalry
Age 4 Units :
Elite Horse Archer - Elite Lancer
Myth Units :
Satyr - Necromancer - Avenger
Heros :
Pharaoh - Creationist - Creator (Hero)
Siege Units :
Stone Thrower - Helopolis

Cultural Technology - Book of Secrets
Civilization Technology - Composite Bow

Assyrian gain faith by building Sun Temples.
Sun Temples are also used for global resource collection, age upgrades, and making myth/hero units.

---------

Carthage



Technologies are cheaper.
Ships do more damage.
Better market values in buy/sell.
Villagers build faster.
Ships and buildings have more armor.
Outposts are cheaper.
Villagers fish faster.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Lancer - Spearman - Bowman
Age 3 Units :
Short Bowman - Camelry - Numidian Cavalry
Age 4 Units :
Elite War Elephant - Elite Falcatasman
Myth Units :
Psychic - Petsuchos - Astrologist
Heros :
Priest - Psychic (Hero) - Astrologist (Hero)
Siege Units :
Ballista - Helopolis

Cultural Technology - Book of Secrets
Civilization Technology - Armored Tusks

Carthage gain faith by praying at temples. They also use normal type resource collection buildings.
---------

Shang



Villagers gather crops faster.
Mounted Carts are cheaper.
Cavalry cost less.
Walls are free.
Villagers train faster, cost less, and have less hp.
Buildings are cheaper.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Lancer - Crossbow Concept - Maceman
Age 3 Units :
Chariot - War Elephant - Javelin Cavalry
Age 4 Units :
Crossbow Prototype - Village Raider
Myth Units :
Satyr - Dragon/Spitting Serpent - Astrologist
Heros :
Monk - Astrologist (Hero)
Siege Units :
Siege Tower - Fire Siphon

Cultural Technology - Harsh Terrain Training
Civilization Technology - Eyes in The Forest

Shang pretty much gets everything cheaper.
They gain faith by praying at temples.

---------


Choson



Buildings that shoot have more range, cost less, and attack faster.
Infantry have 50% more hp.
Creationist do more damage and attack faster.
Siege weapons have more range.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Swordsman - Slinger - Spearman
Age 3 Units :
Chariot Archer - Composite Bowman - Raiding Cavalry
Age 4 Units :
Assassin - Dual Wielder
Myth Units :
Satyr - Petsuchos - The Creator
Heros :
Creationist - Creator (Hero)
Siege Units :
Ballista - Catapult

Cultural Technology - Harsh Terrain Training
Civilization Technology - Bravery

Choson gain faith by praying at temples and use a mounted cart to collect most resources.

---------


Yamato



Can make a larger militia.
Archers have more armor, move faster, and cost less.
Villagers cost gold, and mine gold faster.
Ships move faster, have more range, and cost less.
Fishing ships have more hp.
Heros have more HP and do more damage.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Myth Seeker (Hero) - Peltast - Throwing Axeman - Spearman
Age 3 Units :
Short Bowman - Chariot - Fortress Raider
Age 4 Units :
Elite Horse Archer - Dual Wielder
Myth Units :
Psychic - Necromancer - Astrologist
Heros :
Myth Seeker - Psychic (Hero) - Cultist - Astrologist (Hero)
Siege Units :
Portable Ram - Helepolis

Cultural Technology - Harsh Terrain Training
Civilization Technology - Hall of Thanes

Yamato gains faith by praying at temples, use a storage pit for resources, can build an armory in age 1, and gets food by cattle.

---------


Persia



Myth units attack faster, cost less, and have more los.
Villagers gater from farms faster.
Buildings that shoot cost less and have less hp.
Farms cost more and have double hitpoints.
Archers cost less gold.
Siege weapons cost less.
Walls cost more.
Ships train faster, cost less, and have less hp.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Maceman - Peltast - Bowman
Age 3 Units :
Javelin Thrower - Chariot - War Elephant - Immortal
Age 4 Units :
Elite Fortress Raider - Elite Chariot
Myth Units :
Automaton - Roc - Necromancer - Astrologist
Heros :
Creationist - Cultist - Astrologist (Hero)
Siege Units :
Portable Ram - Fire Siphon

Cultural Technology - Improved Molds
Civilization Technology - Favorable Positioning

Villagers don't need storage pits of any kind. Gains faith by praying at temples.

---------


Babylon



Buildings that shoot cost more, have less range do more damage, regenerate, and have 75% more hp.
Citadel Centers cost less.
Fishing ships have more hp.
Guilds cost less.
Walls cost more.
Caravans cost less.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Dagger Infantry - Peltast - Bowman
Age 3 Units :
Chariot Archer - Chariot - Camelry
Age 4 Units :
Elite War Elephant - Elite Spear Thrower
Myth Units :
Psychic - Hydra - Chimera
Heros :
Psychic (Hero) - Creator (Hero)
Siege Units :
Stone Thrower - Fire Siphon

Cultural Technology - Improved Molds
Civilization Technology - Legendary Structures

Gains faith by building monuments and praying at monuments.
Villagers do not need a storage pit.
Buildings grow a lush that does not allow enemies to build on it.

---------

Palmyran



Villagers cost more, gather faster, and have more hp/armor.
Has Sky Passages.
Human Soldiers and heros move faster.
Walls cost more.
Caravans have more hp, cost less, and move faster.
Human Soldiers have more damage vs myth units.

Unit List :
Age 2 Units :
Maceman - Lancer - Throwing Axeman
Age 3 Units :
Broad Swordsman - Chariot - Sarissophoroi
Age 4 Units :
Elite Chariot - Elite War Camel
Myth Units :
Psychic - Necromancer - Illusionist
Heros :
Psychic (Hero) - Cultist
Siege Units :
Ballista - Catapult

Cultural Technology - Improved Molds
Civilization Technology - Weightless Weapon Handles

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 04:34 PM).]

PhatFish
Mr. Beta
posted 05-05-12 04:33 PM ET (US)     10 / 17       
Does the name Sublimistri mean anything to you? I'm keeping a close eye on you layz - If your intention is to disrupt threads with your view/and or troll, expect a ban.



layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 04:35 PM ET (US)     11 / 17       
Does the name Sublimistri mean anything to you? I'm keeping a close eye on you layz - If your intention is to disrupt threads with your view/and or troll, expect a ban.
Where have I trolled or disrupted a thread? Look on AoM heaven that's where I mostly posted at and there is no trolling or disrupting going on. That post was actually incidental... Yet I don't have the power to delete my own posts to repost it on this account.

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 04:39 PM).]

PhatFish
Mr. Beta
posted 05-05-12 04:42 PM ET (US)     12 / 17       
I said if. Also, you're using multiple accounts to advertise/get your view out, which is against the CoC. Berrythief, Sublimistri, and the one youre using now. You can either stop using the former two and continue with layz or face a ban. See this as your first warning.



layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 04:44 PM ET (US)     13 / 17       
YeaI believe I made one account for aom heaven. Another one for aoe heaven when i first got here.

And one was to post about thrones of time (berry thief) to keep that account away from being linked to my account that I was asking script questions with.

I just recently found out the forums are linked by having a mishap like you just seen, posting on an account I didn't mean to post on.

I think it should be quite obvious that I had just posted on aom heaven as sublimistri, came here and meant to post on this name saying that in that thread, why would I say that on that name it doesn't make sense at all. Chosen for what?

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 04:52 PM).]

Thompsoncs
Clubman
posted 05-05-12 04:53 PM ET (US)     14 / 17       
Unless you significantly changed the aom engine, I would agree with Phatfish that it is a mod. Changing stats and graphics isn't a remake, it's a mod. AoK might use the same basis engine as AoE, the ai and engine were quite a bit updated, making it really another game.

Though I myself am no fan of aom, your project looks interesting, and as modder of the Age of Italy mod, I know how much time goes in such projects. Respect for your work.

But selling it sounds like a really bad idea, in fact it might be illegal. Every mod I know of, is free (they sometimes ask to donate money to maintain the project, but is never required). You use the aom engine, and if you try to make money with that, aom deserves a portion of it. I (or hope I do) avoid that by keeping my project non-profit 100% free and crediting microsoft and ES for their work.

Asking money and providing the game with a cd is killing for the number of people who will actually play your mod. First they need to accept paying money for something, then they have to provide personal information to make sure the cd is delivered a their house.
layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 04:55 PM ET (US)     15 / 17       
The engine has been updated, the rate at which villagers build when they are all building on one building for example is one thing that has been changed.

There is nothing being sold except for a pvpnet account for access to the pvp lobby, forums, and update page. That account information gets mailed to you. The cd comes for free with it that includes an install.

Not illegal for me to sell my own accounts and give the game away to those members only it is silly to think so.

Saying it's a mod is a huge understatement, an insult In my point of view.

If you don't think I've given Microsoft credit you should check anywhere. Literally, anywhere. Rise of Rome and Age of Mythology are said all over the website and here and there. However the mod I made they really had nothing to do with that other than supplying me with a portrait to paint on, and the remake is where I deserve credit.


I think you don't understand.

I never said it was an AoM remake. I said it was an AoM EXPANSION.

I said it was a RISE OF ROME REMAKE. If you read the civilizations thier bonuses, and thier units, it clearly is a ror remake. However it is also a lot different in its own way.

There's also no such thing as lightning mode anymore. That mode has been changed DRASTICALLY to reflect AoERoRs DM.

It's now called OG DM Mode (Original Game DeathMatch Mode).
Original game being AoERoR.


As sublimistri I posted a few "mods" in the downloads section. I will accept those as being called "mods", this... No. My caribbean map has been redone to be a more professional and normal type map (animal wise on the center island), so has the texture of the map been completely redone, and the size.

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-05-2012 @ 06:00 PM).]

Basse
Clubman
posted 05-05-12 06:52 PM ET (US)     16 / 17       
There's also no such thing as lightning mode anymore. That mode has been changed DRASTICALLY to reflect AoERoRs DM.

It's now called OG DM Mode (Original Game DeathMatch Mode).
Original game being AoERoR.
OG DM Mode? Is it like normal deathmatch? Sounds interresting nonetheless
That account information gets mailed to you. The cd comes for free with it that includes an install.
Can you clear this out please. Giving away the game for free? How will you afford that? 25 dollars for the account, that means none of that money should go for the game itself, right?
Thank you for clearing this out in the mail
The CD only contains the Mod files. But as I said earlier, I think it would be easier to provide a download link. It will be way cheaper for you

[This message has been edited by Basse (edited 05-05-2012 @ 06:55 PM).]

layz
Banned
posted 05-05-12 07:01 PM ET (US)     17 / 17       
OG DM Mode disables all myth units, heros and titan.

It has normal gather/build and train rates.

The biggest two things that sets it apart from AoM's normal deathmatch and why it was needed to reflect rors dm.

In aoms dm all the techs come with the upgrade of an age. In RoR the techs have to all be manually researched.

The second thing is in RoR you normally started off in Iron Age.

So what I did was enabled the Ziggurats (These are like a temple and town center in one). In the very first age. These are a town center that does not need the socket, and I was originally going to make them all like that but decided to keep the sockets for normal tcs.

This allows you to do a similar build order to rise of rome where you build multiple town centers for faster villager production.

In this game I wanted upgrade buildings to be important. As far as AoEO goes, you could be player #1 and never even build one. Counter units there, what are those?

That type of stuff you never seen in ror, unheard of, people will build multiples of the upgrade buildings to get thier upgrades with. Not like in "other" ones where you don't even have to know what that is.

Just added the government center, this new organization feels good, superior actually.

Just gotta write my credits soon, I think I'll include microsoft in there along with epic score.

When I organize the rest of the techs tomorrow for the armory this is how the civs will look, it should take me about an hour or less to do it I say an hour because I have to make and delete a few techs for a few civs..
Gov (There's more than that I had to hit a few prerequestites to open up others, thats not a titan gate either there's no such thing, not even sure what you guys would call couple of those other icons anymore, but I know what I call them) :

Hittite Armory :

The model worked, so I guess that's ok, looks good to me for beta. I spend like 15 seconds on some of these things retexturing.. And doing the part on the texture that make them look 5x as good by not even changing anything at all I guess you didn't know about back then.

[This message has been edited by layz (edited 05-06-2012 @ 01:55 AM).]

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