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Age of Empires / Rise of Rome / Definitive Edition
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Age of Empires Heaven » Forums » Age of Empires / Rise of Rome / Definitive Edition » Cataphracts!
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Topic Subject:Cataphracts!
CenturionZ_1
Clubman
posted 04-03-01 03:47 PM ET (US)         
Well, I still can't believe it. Two out of two wins for a cataphract strategy! It all started when I was Macedonian. I was planning a bronze hoplite rush but only to find at 15 mins, he had towers, a defence and walls. Plus those CAs kept disrupting my formation. I decided to secretly push to Iron and build HAs to counter this problem.

5 mins later I hit Iron with only 30 food. I slowly regained my economy to find he had built a massive army and started using a camel/CA rush. My HAs and hoppers were badly wasted. (He was Shang) I tried to hold but to my horror he had destroyed my academies and archery ranges. I had only my stables and siege workshops left. ST proved slow and inaffective. The camels just rushed it. Then he hit Iron and started cranking out scythes! I realised ST would be pretty useless. I despartely built one archery range to fund he had killed all my woodcutters. In desoaration I turned on my stable and cavalry. They rushed out and I realised my gold was evaporating but anyway they somehow seemed to hold out against the scythes! Niw I knew a cavalry and sentry towers are equal so I flattened his towers. Within 2 mins, I reached hvy cavalry and wiped out his scythe and CAs. As for the camels, my new phalnxes killed them. Then he resigned!


CenturionZ_1
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BlitzkreigComin
Clubman
posted 04-03-01 06:18 PM ET (US)     1 / 7       
CenturionZ_1:

I'm actually shocked myself to hear that Cataphract did anything against an army of Scythe. He must have had a smaller economy. Scythe with their cost and area damage make Cataphract obsolete in post-Iron wars.

Are these Cataphract strategies for RM? I am assuming they are. I would like to play you one of these days (when I'm not too lazy) and see how it works. I have never seen a group of Cataphract dominate a battlefield when the game was still up for grabs.... meaning Cataphract wasn't finishing off a smaller army of anything/everything.

wedsaz
Clubman
posted 04-03-01 06:57 PM ET (US)     2 / 7       
CenturionZ_1:
camels/CAs - You could have used compies, you know.
scythes/camels/CAs - Ballista towers would have done the trick here, advancing with cents or eles.
 
The only thing I've found cataphracts to be really effective against is massed dual siege (which some think mauls mace, hehe).
 
BlitzkreigComin:
I can see some other possibilities, like maybe the scythes weren't upgraded for example.
 
I've seen cataphracts be useful as a support unit, especially with civs who lack scythes. The main part of the army is usually something else though.
Caesar Constintine
Clubman
posted 04-03-01 09:17 PM ET (US)     3 / 7       
I find cataphracts to be good against villagers, tool units, archers, and siege- but find that it is no longer "needed" to upgrade to cataphract since not to many use them as a main unit anymore. As with most units, never underestimate them, atleast not in a skilled persons strategy. I never use them as a main unit, but as a main support troop, yes- of course all depending on the enemy and their moves.
CenturionZ_1
Clubman
posted 04-04-01 03:17 PM ET (US)     4 / 7       
wedsaz:

He was using CAs/scythes/camels. Mace have no camels or chariots. I only used HAs/phalanx/cataphracts.

Now I tried a cataphract DM rush. Well I saw all my hopes dissolve in my first match. I played a Greek player using centurions and I saw my cataphracts massacred.

Then when I played a Roman player, I remarkably won! I instantly took all the gold mines and I found one cataphract could take 2 legions before dying. Then I neutralized his siege and with HHA support, I sorted out his cents!


CenturionZ_1
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wedsaz
Clubman
posted 04-04-01 04:02 PM ET (US)     5 / 7       
CenturionZ_1:
I think you misunderstood what I said earlier. Either that or you weren't listening.
 
1. Against camels+CAs (in bronze) - you could have used compies.
2. Against scythes/camels/CAs (in iron) - you could have used ballista towers.
3. A fully upgraded centurion can almost take 3 legions, and costs only half as much gold as a cataphract, so it's a far better counter to legions.
Delirious Lab
Clubman
(id: Benoit)
posted 04-05-01 09:26 AM ET (US)     6 / 7       
wedsaz:
What about speed? All those units you suggest look good by the numbers (hit+attack points), but their speed ranges from slow to immobile. If the enemy chariots run away they're useless.
wedsaz
Clubman
posted 04-05-01 03:38 PM ET (US)     7 / 7       
Benoit:
That's what walls are for. If you keep advancing and walling off areas as they become 'cleared', he'll eventually have nowhere to run. Or, you can advance on his base and if his army doesn't show up, you shoot up his villies and houses instead. Different strategies, that's all.
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